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Turbo or Supercharger?

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My VR6 is pretty standard at the moment, only things different is the stainless steel twin exhaust, induction kit and uprated leads.

Come August/September, I am thinking about doing some serious tuning and Im not sure what path to take and I want to know what you guys think? Shall I turbo it or supercharge it? I obviously want alot more power, but not a ridiculous amount where I might end up killing myself :P

I always thought superchargers force alot more petrol in? thus, going through buckets of more fuel. I dont know much about turbo's or chargers so I need to do some reseach obviously.

Ive had a look at the basics and I will upgrade the cam shafts to 264's before I go ahead with all of this, and obviously sort the cooling out., upgrade brakes etc.

Any suggestions or tips?

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Both turbo and supercharger with require more fuel as they both force in more air. I would of thought that both are as economical as each other, maybe the turbo would be very slightly less as it does not exert a parasitic load on the engine. But then again, the supercharger does not add restriction to the exhaust gases.

The choice of turbo or charger is preference I think.

On the CAM front if you are heading down either FI route then the Schimmel 263 Cam would probably be a better option.

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Theoretically, turbo engines are more economical than both a Normally Aspirated engine of the same power output and also the same size engine with a Supercharger.

Why? Because the exhaust gas is 100% waste on N/A and S/C engines, Turbos recycle it into useable power. Turbo engines only require more fuel when on boost, which isn't that often realistically. Centrifugal Superchargers sap power permanently and only make full boost at the redline, which uses monumental amounts of fuel.

That's the theory anyway, but it can be backed up in real life too. I've had stage 2 and 3 Vortechs (8 and 12psi) on mine before going turbo and I can definitely tell you the Turbo is LOADS more fuel efficient, even running more boost pressure. StormchargedVR6 can back me up on that one :-)

As for "Turbo or Supercharger".......

If you want big torque in the midrange, it can only be a turbo or positive displacement supercharger (Roots / Eatons).

If you want max boost at the redline and nothing below 4000rpm, then a Centrifugal charger is the one to have (Rotrex, Vortech, Z engineering etc)

To me, centrifugal chargers make the engine feel like it's straining to squeeze one out sideways. Turbos make their power a lot more effortlessly, like slipping out a nice pile of Diahorreha.....

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Lol, nicely explained there. Thanks :D

At the moment, Im swaying more towards a turbo, but im going to read up on them both.

Any good turbo's for the VR6 I should take a look at?

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As kev already said :) supercharger v Turbo is like night and day.

I've been down the same road as Kev with the charger and turbo, your best bey is to try and going out in a Turbo VR

and a Charged VR and see for your self.

As for economical, forget the charger .The drag on the engine is a joke, then the noise , belt slip, belt shredding ,crap torque , im sorry there no good points about a charger

can't beat a well setup VRT :) A good setup not cheap but well worth it

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As kev already said :) supercharger v Turbo is like night and day.

I've been down the same road as Kev with the charger and turbo' date=' your best bey is to try and going out in a Turbo VR

and a Charged VR and see for your self.

As for economical, forget the charger .The drag on the engine is a joke, then the noise , belt slip, belt shredding ,crap torque , im sorry there no good points about a charger

can't beat a well setup VRT :) A good setup not cheap but well worth it

[/quote']

wow most peopel on here rave about chargers, thanks for the info :)

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be honest everyone is different ive had a zr2 charger and currently got a vortech v9 charger on stage2 and have been stage3 and never had one single issue runs like a dream no probs at all it does drink more petrol but u cant beat the sound of a vortech on full throttle and only other advantage of being supercharged is if anything does go wrong its very easy to convert back to normal aspirated in a few hours

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Its what floats your boat, i was making 337bhp/281lbft at 12psi with V9 , Now Turbo 401bhp/380lbft at 15 psi

Im making 380lbft of torque at 3k rpm :o Even the rotrex won't make that kind of torque

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Lol' date=' nicely explained there. Thanks :D

At the moment, Im swaying more towards a turbo, but im going to read up on them both.

Any good turbo's for the VR6 I should take a look at?

[/quote']

if you can try and make it to one of the shows at santa pod ull see a few turbos and a few charger vr`s in action

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It all boils down to what you want really. Plus cash plays a big part. Id love to have a setup like Kevs but havent got money or able to have car off road long enough to do that sorta thing. Where as a charger can be bolted up and running in half a day

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if you can try and make it to one of the shows at santa pod ull see a few turbos and a few charger vr`s in action

Ah, I was gonna go this year but didnt have the money!

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if you can try and make it to one of the shows at santa pod ull see a few turbos and a few charger vr`s in action

Ah' date=' I was gonna go this year but didnt have the money!

[/quote']

or come to any show and I am sure someone will take you out for a quick drive so you can see :)

As for economical' date=' forget the charger .The drag on the engine is a joke, then the noise , belt slip, belt shredding ,crap torque , im sorry there no good points about a charger

[/quote']

don't agree mate - since I have had my charger on my fuel economy has not dropped at all and if anything on motorway driving is a bit better, didn't like the moise as much as my ramair to start with but now I love it - sounds evil !! no belt slip whatsoever - you just have to keep an eye on the tension and maintain it well and as a bolt on in half a day application and for the money spent and bhp gained it's fantastic - charger every day for me :)

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What would be the most cost effective setup overall? I mean, chargers seem pretty darn expensive and that's without remaping or modifying....besides, I thought some internals needed replacing and the 10:1 needed lowering on F/I.

Turbo is a lot more maintanence from what I've heard and more bits to attach..

At the moment, I want to go for the cheapest/cost effective way of increasing the ooomph until I can afford a proper set up.

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My VR6 is pretty standard at the moment' date=' only things different is the stainless steel twin exhaust, induction kit and uprated leads.

Come August/September, I am thinking about doing some serious tuning and Im not sure what path to take and I want to know what you guys think? Shall I turbo it or supercharge it? I obviously want alot more power, but not a ridiculous amount where I might end up killing myself :P

I always thought superchargers force alot more petrol in? thus, going through buckets of more fuel. I dont know much about turbo's or chargers so I need to do some reseach obviously.

Ive had a look at the basics and I will upgrade the cam shafts to 264's before I go ahead with all of this, and obviously sort the cooling out., upgrade brakes etc.

Any suggestions or tips?

[/quote']

Personally unless your rich or good with spanners (mechanic or self taught) i don't think owning a turbo VR is a good idea. I can see it been a bit of a mare going turbo if it ever plays up.. Most / if not all turbo owns ive spoken to know a hell of a lot of info and do most of the work them self. and are normally looking to upgrade improve or generaly tinkering

Where as most charger owners seem to bolt on and feget about them (no offense intended) which would suit the less mechanical minded imo

what kind of bhp are you after? cams and brakes don't have to be done but are obs nice

After saying all that personally id go turbo :-d and have my heart set on running a cheep ebay T3 60-1 at 6-8psi on a totally stock engine no intercooler.. should be the cheapest way to get 270 from a VR

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As for economical' date=' forget the charger .The drag on the engine is a joke, then the noise , belt slip, belt shredding ,crap torque , im sorry there no good points about a charger

can't beat a well setup VRT :) A good setup not cheap but well worth it

[/quote']

hmmm... economical? Not a great argument... hands up whose thinking of fitting a turbo to save money?

Whether you choose a turbo or supercharger it's not going to be cheap. Never mind fuel costs, whichever set up you go for it's going to cost you more than your average VR6 is worth ;)

You and kev obviously both know your stuff but to say there are NO good points about chargers is not really given an unbiased view imo. The only problem I had was shredding a couple of belts, I loved the noise and the crap torque meant I wasn't still spinning the wheels in 3rd gear ;)

It's horses for courses there are pros and cons on both sides

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I understand what you're saying about sticking to something that needs less maintenance, I still have ALOT to learn about my VR.

I have yet to put my VR on a rolling road to see what the current bhp is, I dont think it's gonna be great. Although its a 93' model, it has an OBD2 engine. I would ideally like around 260bhp from extra mods, and I know there's not much else I can do (apart from remaps and chips) to increase the bhp without adding a turbo.

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i agree with Dub...i have run my charger without any issues and i use it as a daily and it gets hammered!!!! but then again its serviced frequent and i look after it

this question has been asked so many times on all forums and you always get a batch of mixed reviews ....i was the same before i put the charger on , did not know which route to go.....

i went for middle range stage 2 charger as i needed to use the car everyday and do i need 350BHP? not really.....290bhp is good for now and i got the stage 3 bits if i want to go more....

you ave to think about it sensibly , what the point of having all that power if its not put to good use...I understand why people want it as its nice to have on tap....

i would say its down to you , try a ride in them both and see which one you like and what cost they involve...

for me a charger is easy to change and remove and get back to standard so if you ever sell the car its a way to make more cash if you want to split them...

but each to their own..lol

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Whether you choose a turbo or supercharger it's not going to be cheap. Never mind fuel costs' date=' whichever set up you go for it's going to cost you more than your average VR6 is worth ;) [/quote']

Very true but we don't do this for financial reasons do we? We do it for the challenge and for the love the car.

Personally, I like doing turbos for the fabrication work, which I really enjoy. It's a hobby. Yes it costs a lot of money, but the reward is a very fast car you can't buy from any show room. No 2 VRTs / VRSCs are the same, they all have little differences unique to their owners and I find that appealing and interesting.

You and kev obviously both know your stuff but to say there are NO good points about chargers is not really given an unbiased view imo. The only problem I had was shredding a couple of belts' date=' I loved the noise and the crap torque meant I wasn't still spinning the wheels in 3rd gear ;) [/quote']

Don't forget Shaun and I ran high boost from our Vortechs, which is where the troubles start. If you stick to 6 or 8psi, then yeah, it's relatively trouble free as you say.

Going Turbo has highlighted that no one ever commented on how fast my car was when it was S/C'd, but they certainly do now :-) All they ever used to say was "What's that silly noise coming from the bonnet?". I actually used to feel embarrassed driving past bus queues in traffic because it was such an irritating noise.

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Don't forget Shaun and I ran high boost from our Vortechs' date=' which is where the troubles start. If you stick to 6 or 8psi, then yeah, it's relatively trouble free as you say.

Going Turbo has highlighted that no one ever commented on how fast my car was when it was S/C'd, but they certainly do now :-) All they ever used to say was "What's that silly noise coming from the bonnet?". I actually used to feel embarrassed driving past bus queues in traffic because it was such an irritating noise.

[/quote']

Everyone needs to go out in a VRT :)

Got to agree Kev the noise was irritating

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I hate this forum sometimes ( in a good way of course). Just when I have finally got my head around what I was going to do, which was going the Rotrex route, I read a post like this and am now erring towards a turbo again. I was literally going to order it end of this week now I will have to ponder some more. Suppose these discussions will help me in the long run pick the FI route that suites me best :)

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