Performance valve springs,collets etc(Bar-tek?)

[Lowlifedubber 9]

I dont usually do very well on here regarding replies but i will have another go regardless.

As im in the process of rebuilding a 2.96 vr6T from the bottom up,im at the stage where im thinking about the cylinder head upgrades.

Ive been looking on https://bar-tek.de/bar-tek-tuning.de/ and have come across some Shrick Valve springs,keepers/collets/washers and lifters.

http://www.bar-tek-tuning.de/cgi-bin/cosmoshop/lshop.cgi?action=showdetail&artnum=001302062_001302026_vr6&wkid=27125&ls=de&nocache=1347894587-28124

http://www.bar-tek-tuning.de/cgi-bin/cosmoshop/lshop.cgi?action=showdetail&artnum=089500811_14&wkid=27125&ls=de&nocache=1347894587-28124

http://www.bar-tek-tuning.de/cgi-bin/cosmoshop/lshop.cgi?action=showdetail&artnum=21vr013&wkid=27125&ls=de&nocache=1347894587-28124

http://www.bar-tek-tuning.de/cgi-bin/cosmoshop/lshop.cgi?action=showdetail&wkid=27125&ls=de&nc=1347895461-28752&rubnum=&artnum=21vr006&file=45&gesamt_zeilen=0Tsuche--vr6

Im still debating the lifters but the other stuff as it only comes in at £230 delivered i think i may benefit from.Im planning on using standard size Ferrea sodium filled valves in a ported and polished head sat on a 82.5mm forged bottom end.

Are there any downsides to fitting HD springs?Im guessing there will be a bit of strain on the chain/tensioners but they will be new genuine items.

Also has anyone used Bar-tek before?Suggest any other brands you have used or different companys to source the parts?

Cheers

Gary

[cabrioman 6]

ive been looking into uprated head bits and i have already got my big valves just need the springs and retainers .... £230 delivered for schrick stuff its not bad i was looking at supertech valve springs and retainers on eBay, £150 plus postage .....

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Ah thats a good price!I know Shrick is tried and tested stuff,not heard so much about supertech.

Just out of interest,what sort of money were your 12valves and valve seats?

[FishWick 21]

You can see worthwhile gains from larger valves in the VR6 head. I went 1mm over size. Ferrea stainless inlets and inconel exhaust. Those and SP 263 cams saw a 50hp gain from the same boost.

As for the titanium valvetrain parts and uprated springs, I would only recommend these if planning on extending the rev range past 7000.

I don't like uprated springs. They put too much strain on the cam gear and cam lobes as already said. Even with the best oils money can buy, I was seeing lobe pitting after 50K miles when using uprated springs.

I don't think the Schrick springs are quite as strong as the American ones, but even so, be careful with them!

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Ok mate,thanks for the advice.

I see your very much in the know with all things vr6 so would you suggest just a good set of genuine valvetrain items?

As for revving above 7k,you know what i honestly dont know.I have the mk3 and im building an engine to go in it but as daft as it is ive nbever been in a vr6 lol

I much prefer low down torque and pulling power rather than a screaming high revving engine and i was hoping to get my power band kicking in around 3500-4000rpm and see where it takes me.I really must get a drive in one but there are no modified vr6's in my area so im working a little blind.

[Daverse 175]

Ok mate' date='thanks for the advice.

I see your very much in the know with all things vr6 so would you suggest just a good set of genuine valvetrain items?

As for revving above 7k,you know what i honestly dont know.I have the mk3 and im building an engine to go in it but as daft as it is ive nbever been in a vr6 lol

I much prefer low down torque and pulling power rather than a screaming high revving engine and i was hoping to get my power band kicking in around 3500-4000rpm and see where it takes me.I really must get a drive in one but there are no modified vr6's in my area so im working a little blind.

[/quote']

One day

[Lowlifedubber 9]

You need to pull your finger out Dave,at this rate i will be done before you and i only started on my engine a month ago lol.

Make sure your stocked up with coffee for wednesday btw

[cabrioman 6]

You can see worthwhile gains from larger valves in the VR6 head. I went 1mm over size. Ferrea stainless inlets and inconel exhaust. Those and SP 263 cams saw a 50hp gain from the same boost.

As for the titanium valvetrain parts and uprated springs' date=' I would only recommend these if planning on extending the rev range past 7000.

I don't like uprated springs. They put too much strain on the cam gear and cam lobes as already said. Even with the best oils money can buy, I was seeing lobe pitting after 50K miles when using uprated springs.

I don't think the Schrick springs are quite as strong as the American ones, but even so, be careful with them!

[/quote']

sounds very much to what I have, I `ve got 1mm over sized inlet and exhaust Ferrea valves waiting to go in .....

[cabrioman 6]

Ah thats a good price!I know Shrick is tried and tested stuff' date='not heard so much about supertech.

Just out of interest,what sort of money were your 12valves and valve seats?

[/quote']

got mine from eBay was about £140 for all 12 i think ( 1mm oversized inlet and exhaust Ferrea valves) going to get my mate to re-cut the seats in the head for me ....

[Daverse 175]

You need to pull your finger out Dave' date='at this rate i will be done before you and i only started on my engine a month ago lol.

Make sure your stocked up with coffee for wednesday btw

[/quote']

Dont worry about that, i always have plenty in reserve for such events

I know, my progress has been painfully slow, its embarassing! But i like to think of it as a fine wine, matures with age

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Ah thats a good price!I know Shrick is tried and tested stuff' date='not heard so much about supertech.

Just out of interest,what sort of money were your 12valves and valve seats?

[/quote']

got mine from eBay was about £140 for all 12 i think ( 1mm oversized inlet and exhaust Ferrea valves) going to get my mate to re-cut the seats in the head for me ....

Ah thats a good price.Ive heard mixed reviews about the actual gains of going oversize valves but im still unsure.

Are the valve seats happy taking an extra mm out of them?No problems with burning them out due to less material and excess heat?

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Dont worry about that' date=' i always have plenty in reserve for such events

I know, my progress has been painfully slow, its embarassing! But i like to think of it as a fine wine, matures with age

[/quote']

Good to hear!lol i hope you realise im bringing my tape to rape some dimensions of your sri. 8-|

[cabrioman 6]

Ah thats a good price!I know Shrick is tried and tested stuff' date='not heard so much about supertech.

Just out of interest,what sort of money were your 12valves and valve seats?

[/quote']

got mine from eBay was about £140 for all 12 i think ( 1mm oversized inlet and exhaust Ferrea valves) going to get my mate to re-cut the seats in the head for me ....

Ah thats a good price.Ive heard mixed reviews about the actual gains of going oversize valves but im still unsure.

Are the valve seats happy taking an extra mm out of them?No problems with burning them out due to less material and excess heat?

dont know yet not heard anything like that happening before ??!! mine seat have gone slightly oval and the original valves were slightly bent as well so decided to go the whole hog ....

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Ah sweet.Well ive just Hot tanked my cylinder head and now im setting about porting and polishing it.

If you find you need another head to work with,ive just hot tanked another head and got it skimmed if you feel you would rather work with one with decent guides and seats

[michael5556 247]

Is there any point going bigger on the exhaust say 2mm and 1mm inlet?

Also is it worth getting any other work done like port matching gaskets etc?

This is a good thread!

And Daverse mine will be ready for pod in October so we can do yours after that. Text me.

[Daverse 175]

Ive considered this before, and i reckon you can only go 2mm either way, 1mm on each valve or 2 on one. Otherwise the seats will clash. If your doing head work you may as well blueprint the manifolds to get all that air shifted. Again its just how far you want to go with the project.

And yeah michael ill give you a buzz, especially about the painting, just got some other work rubbish to sort first

[cabrioman 6]

Is there any point going bigger on the exhaust say 2mm and 1mm inlet?

Also is it worth getting any other work done like port matching gaskets etc?

This is a good thread!

And Daverse mine will be ready for pod in October so we can do yours after that. Text me.

with forced induction i can`t see the point in porting and polishing ...... if you want the air to flow faster turn up the boost, well that what i think anyway and have been told by a few people in the know .....

[michael5556 247]

Yeah. I'm running a turbo anyway. But looking at buying a spare head. Rebuilding it completely. As with the thread starter. Looking at freeing up the head and making it flow better. But I know with these things there is a certain point where it becomes pointless and just a cost.

Yeah drop me a text

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Some interesting replies here.Im now tipping over the fence towards banging some larger valves on the inlet side now lol.

Ive got all my engineers blue so i will be blueprinting the whole head and gasket matching to the new Newsouth inlet/exhaust gaskets ive just received.

Im going to be spending a few more hours on the porting and polishing today inbetween doing other peoples cars i have booked in.

The bloody valve bowls are going to be fiddly to do mind!

Then once thats done i will send this one off to be skimmed and then get some new guides in there and a 3 angle job on whatever valves i decide on.

I have everything for my bottom end now,just got one more set of rings to gap and im ready for build up as soon as my plastigauge comes.

[Daverse 175]

Its all coming together as Fishwick said, the head can be a worthwhile mod, and all the work you do on the head means all the better the engine will be for it. Plus with better air flow you can run less boost for the same power

[michael5556 247]

Maybe we should sticky this thread as there is some good info in here.

[FishWick 21]

The reason I mentioned going over 7000rpm is because of turbo sizing. If you're going with a GT30 sized turbo and stock intake, the torque band is pretty much done by 5500-6000rpm, depending on turbine housing AR.

With a GT35R and short runner intake, it'll rip round to 7K before you know it! It would be nice to extend the rev range to 7500rpm and give you a bit more top end. Personally, I hate turbo engines that peak too early. I like an endless power band like M3 engines.

The Americans have been revving VRTs to 8000rpm for years and more recently, 8500rpm with 288 cams (Texas Mile MK3 200mph run). But to get up there you're looking at the aforementioned valvetrain and a bigger turbo. Something in the region of a GT40R+. Whether the block likes revving out that far or not is debatable, but it's been done!

I forgot to mention my valves were 3 angle jobs and the stems were diamater reduced (in the combustion area only), plus the intake ports were gasket matched. These changes plus the cams made a huge difference. Finally the engine could breathe properly and off boost, with 8.5 CR and a short runner, my VRT made a stock VR6 feel like an absolute dog on it's last legs, it was incredibly slow and unresponsive!

Remember, anything you do to improve the flow in a normally aspirated engine will make the boost better too. It's why Honda VTECs make good turbo engines

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Right i see.Ive narrowed my turbo down to either a precision 6262 or a GT35R.I will be using an SRI too.

I will be getting 3 angle jobs on the valves but im interested in the reduced diameter in the combustion area?Did you get these machined?If so how did you know how far to go before you loose strength?

What sort of power are you running with everything combined?

People keep telling me to read your build thread but im buggered if i can find it lol.

Thanks again for the help.All very useful!

[Daverse 175]

www.vr6oc.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?139931, i would get a string coffee if your doing it in one!

[Lowlifedubber 9]

Excellent,thanks Dave.Ive had enough of port polishing for one day so will make a start.