Should I get a VR6?

[tubby 0]

Ha ha ha 150 miles for 20 quid lmfao maybe just maybe if you drive like miss daisey,but then there would be no point owning one.

They do like a drink you know

:-p

[mike 6]

i get about 110 from 20 quid mate, which isnt amazing but you learn to live with it lol smile per mile and all that. 230 ish to a 45quid tank...had 270 doin motorways tho.

its a good car for a balance of power and drivability...it doesnt have 300 bhp like some cars.(evo ect)..but you cant use those cars daily aswell as a vr...

[purple highline monster 0]

i dunno i get around 130-150 from £20 fill up and i aint exactly light footed

[tubby 0]

Did forget to mention all my journeys are quite short with a lot of stop starting

[jims13 6]

dont do it, buy a citeron or something else.......... leaves all the nice ones for me

seriously though, best car i have ever had, not as fast as some ive had, but it sounds the nuts. there ok to run, bits are good to, not to pricey like some. and you get vw reliability.. buy the best you can afford,and you should'nt go to far wrong

[matth76 1]

The later VR's (which have a better ecu) do have around 185bhp as opposed to the earlier VR's (1995 or earlier) which have 174bhp.

Petrol isn't really an issue if you drive normally (i.e keep the revs below 4k). I get 32mpg. £40ish to fill it up on Tesco 99 ron will get a full tank and about 300miles if not slightly more. Although I try not to let it get into the red (as that isn't good for any engine) so I could in fact get 30 more miles to a tank. I'm not light footed either but I drive it normally during the week to work etc and have fun with it at the weekend when I can. Slow town traffic is the killer though...but same with any petrol car above 2ltrs.

Well worth getting. Try to get a later 1996 P reg onwards to get the obd2 model. Don't just go for the "highline" model..look around at all the vr's for sale. Some sellers bulk their price up purely because it is a highline. You shouldn't pay much more for one at all! Get one if you want wooden interior trim and leather seats and air con.. but thats the only difference. The engine is exactly the same. Timing chains is just a normal maintenance issue. This is not a "problem" with the vr. It normally needs doing at the 80-100k mile mark - the noise is a faint raspy rattling sound. However if the sound isn't there then they wont need doing. Sometimes the chains last well up to 150k mile mark. The vr does not have head gasket problems at all. Not sure who conjured that one up. The vr engine is very bullet proof. The german lump will far outlast most modern engines on "lesser" makes of car. Most vr's actually run very well if over 100k miles. They should last quite easily up to 200k miles and beyond as long as it is serviced properly.

As long as you get one that is fully serviced every 10k miles or every year which ever is sooner you can't go wrong. Servicing costs no more than a normal car which is good. Depending on where you live The Phirm and Stealth Racing are the best in the UK for servicing the VR. They are inexpensive too. The only cost I pay out on every 5 months is front tyres (not overly expensive at £50-65 all in) but I do a lot of driving. Brakes last an extremely long time time. My pads have lasted nearly 30k miles!

Best bet if you do find one you want to buy is to first ring the garage up that has recently serviced it to find out if any work is liable to need doing in the near future. Will help you get the price down too. Also ask the seller how long he lets the car warm up and what revs he/she takes the car over during this warm up period. If they look at you blankly I'd be very very cautious. The engine on any performance car should be allowed to warm up from cold for at least 10-15 mins and the revs kept below 3000-3500revs.

As said previously the VR is a very capable car. A lot of the quoted performance figures are very conservative and possibly for the earlier lower powered obd1 vr. An obd2 vr with an air filter and exhaust will get sub 7 secs 0-60 and storm all the way to 140-150mph. And it drives very smoothly. It does sound awesome if you let it breathe properly with an air filter and stainless exhaust. Best to uprate the suspension too which can be done all in for around £400 but isn't a priority - get it done when you can and it will improve the handling and look a lot. Rust isn't an issue on most of the VR's as they are galvanised unless they have been in some kind of accident in their past. I got my P reg 1997 with full service hist excellent condition etc with 69k miles for £3400. That was nearly two years ago. So for a car with higher mileage and 2 years later you are basically looking at £2500 for a very good example one. Very good value car. The 6 cylinders def make the car very smooth compared to smaller engines. I don't think I will ever look at a 2ltr car again.. even if it had a turbo or not. Good luck mate.

[Guest redrobbie]

Thanks for the in depth post Matth76, covered all my queries really (you should get that added to the buyers guide too!). Big thanks to all of you that replied, didn't expect so much and its all been appreciated.

So the highline just has a couple of extras in terms of the trim inside and 'uniqueness'. What's the main difference between the obd2 model, is it just the ecu?

[stuart colgan 0]

Yeah I got my VR6 a year ago and they are sweet cars, but there are a few issues... the fuel consumption is terrible, people try and argue this but if u like putting ur foot down (and who doesnt when the vr6 sounds that gd!) then the consumption is crap for a small hatchback... put it this way my new GTI ed 30 is a lot quicker than my vr6 and does 35mpg even when ragged.

Also the steering on the VR6 is poor, very heavy turn ins, especially on tracks, there is a rust issue on pre 97 cars, esp on the 4 jack spots under the car...and most 2nd hand cars have been thrashed so most ppl's BHP claims are simply wrong... a 95 car with 100k + miles will not been running at 172 bhp, much more like 150bhp(+ a vr6 will simply not keep up with a new mk 5 gti, ppl claiming 200+bhp ina vr6 can not translate that power to the road in a 0-60), and watch out for stupid mods like replica wheels (very heavy, poor quality that de-value the car ) and de-badging, basically keep it OEM and avoid the tesco car park burnout brigade

however.... its harder to go faster for less cash (clio 172's are much better handling though) BUT.. if u really want the ultimate hot hatch go for a RENAULT CLIO WILLIAMS (pref the ltd edition mk 2 model) as much as I love my vr6 and hate all things French the clio williams is the best, where the vr6 is heavy and boomy, the williams is like a porsche hatchback, and I wish I had never sold mine. they are badly made though, the french make there cars in a barn with hammers...

but the vr6 is well built, reliable, powerfull, fairly subtle and will deliver a big grin every time you drive it..plus u get things like this owners club which is truly awesome and run by some of the most dedicated enthusiats u can find!! good luck and go for an OBD2 (better engine and electronics) in a darker colour in 3 door(less weight) non highline (highlines weigh more therefore not as fast)!!

[Focker-out 0]

Also the steering on the VR6 is poor, very heavy turn ins, especially on tracks, there is a rust issue on pre 97 cars, esp on the 4 jack spots under the car...and most 2nd hand cars have been thrashed so most ppl's BHP claims are simply wrong... a 95 car with 100k + miles will not been running at 172 bhp, much more like 150bhp(+ a vr6 will simply not keep up with a new mk 5 gti, ppl claiming 200+bhp ina vr6 can not translate that power to the road in a 0-60), and watch out for stupid mods like replica wheels (very heavy, poor quality that de-value the car ) and de-badging, basically keep it OEM and avoid the tesco car park burnout brigade

An iteresting opinion, but somewhat flawed id say, i have owned 4 VR6s and the current car sits at 134k and has a proven 194 bhp and funnily enough has been the best of the 4, so i would disagree with your opinion of a car losing 20bhp through mileage. Also the VR6 was never ever built to be a HOT HATCH, along the same lines as the Clio Williams, it was built to be a capable high performance luxury hatch, and was a direct competitor of the E36 BMW 325/328, so the 0-60 times were never amazing due to the layout and charachteristics of the engine, it is a very heavy engine and was designed with mid range pull in mind.

De badging, why is it stupid??

[mike 6]

De badging' date=' why is it stupid??

[/quote']

i was thinking the same thing, loads of people from the club do it

[tubby 0]

I also talk a load of ****"

I would tend to agree

[purple highline monster 0]

the fuel consumption is terrible' date=' people try and argue this but if u like putting ur foot down (and who doesnt when the vr6 sounds that gd!) then the consumption is crap for a small hatchback... put it this way my new GTI ed 30 is a lot quicker than my vr6 and does 35mpg even when ragged.

Also the steering on the VR6 is poor, very heavy turn ins, especially on tracks, there is a rust issue on pre 97 cars, esp on the 4 jack spots under the car...and most 2nd hand cars have been thrashed so most ppl's BHP claims are simply wrong... a 95 car with 100k + miles will not been running at 172 bhp, much more like 150bhp(+ a vr6 will simply not keep up with a new mk 5 gti, ppl claiming 200+bhp ina vr6 can not translate that power to the road in a 0-60), and watch out for stupid mods like replica wheels (very heavy, poor quality that de-value the car ) and de-badging, basically keep it OEM and avoid the tesco car park burnout brigade

however.... its harder to go faster for less cash (clio 172's are much better handling though) BUT.. if u really want the ultimate hot hatch go for a RENAULT CLIO WILLIAMS (pref the ltd edition mk 2 model) as much as I love my vr6 and hate all things French the clio williams is the best, where the vr6 is heavy and boomy, the williams is like a porsche hatchback, and I wish I had never sold mine. they are badly made though, the french make there cars in a barn with hammers...

(highlines weigh more therefore not as fast)!!

[/quote']

Some interesting views! fuel is fuel.....wehn you talk about comparing a 2.0 gti to a near 3 litre one then obviously the fuel is gonna be comparitive higher in it use! thats like saying i love my Ferrari but i hate filling it up with petrol! you wouldnt buy it if you were only concerened on fuel consumption alone......

the vr6 was designed as a fast road car and autobahn cruiser with some decent punch, NOT an out and out track car, if you want to make anything production worthy of use on a track you need to spend the money on the items that make it suitable, like anti roll bars, bushing, clutch, and suspension/tyres and other specialist items designed for the job

the claim about a VR being no match for a Mk5?? what books you been reading? i personally anhialated a Mk5 GTI on an empty motorway a few months back, and he was ringing every last bit out of it, the mid rane torque and power of the VR engine above 70 mph are astounding for a car of its age, I was pulling away from him in every gear after 3rd upto....well lets keep that secret! but it was 3 figures and the middle one was a 4 that was proven by the driver of said gti pulling up beside me at the slip off and showing an approving thumbs up!!!! and mines only got a stainless exhaust Everything else is totally standard even the air filter and its done 91k not bad for a heavy old P reg Highline eh?

Williams clio "Porsche Hatchback"????????????????? NO NO NO ......NO....NO if anything its more like a point and squirt kiddy car.............i have driven Porsches of varying types.....Turbo cabrio.....targa and my best mates 1973 RS 911, i have also had the displeasure of driving a 172 clio and a williams 1......cant say anything too positive about them? other than they are what they are....small... badly built French tripe that goes ok but just dosnt have any......Va Va Voooom... the Volkswagen brand offers so much more than just speed or anything else, its a package and an extremely well engineered car...not a 5 minute wonder with a racing teams name put on it!!!

Dont get me wrong this aint a personal dig at you mate, I just dont agree with some of the observations

[matth76 1]

A friend of mine has a clio williams and is lightly tuned. My car still leaves it dead.

Older cars even obd1's will quite often run at the very least 180bhp. This is proven on many a rolling road outing. Obd2 cars on average have at least 185-190bhp. These are the words of Stealth Racing who are the foremost tuner in the UK when it comes to the ecu and rolling road tuning. The person who owns them used to do engineering on VW cup cars and certainly knows his stuff. The quoted factory figure of 174 is very conservative but as always the bhp will always vary from every brand new car.

I have personally outrun a civic type r who was certainly on my tail trying to keep up. It was close but at higher speed the vr gained a sizable gap. My car is only lightly tuned. I even kept up with a Porsche boxter when they tried to accelerate hard in front of me (and they were revving it hard as I could clearly hear). All the way up to 70 there was nothing in it. Not sure what version of boxter it was as I know they have had different power levels but I do know the civic type r has a sub-7 sec quoted 0-60 so mine can't be much different. A person at work has an audi S3 (not the latest one - the one with 220bhp) and my car keeps up with his. This is mainly due to the S3 being much heavier. In fact the VR is relatively light with kerb weight being only 1170kgs.. This is slightly lighter than a civic type R and somewhat lighter than the mk5 GTI which weighs over 1300kgs.

However having said all that the VR is such a pleasure to drive at normal speeds (I just let the people who are always in a hurry rev past)...it is just so smooth to cruise in. I like putting my foot down but I don't feel the need to do it all the time so fuel consumption can be kept well in the 30's. I can quite easily get 35-37mpg if driving constantly at 70ish.

You are right.. the main difference between obd2 and obd1 is the ecu. In fact the obd refers to the type of ecu - "on board diagnostics". There are other differences in throttle body and inlet manifold but not a lot else. By the way not getting air con can be a good thing as air con weighs approx 25kgs!

[Guest redrobbie]

Sorry if this sounds stupid but if its just the ecu that is different then would it be possible to get a pre 1997 VR6 and replace the ecu with the Obd2 of a post 1997 and achieve the same result or is there a LOT more to it then that? *-)

[stuart colgan 0]

the fuel consumption is terrible' date=' people try and argue this but if u like putting ur foot down (and who doesnt when the vr6 sounds that gd!) then the consumption is crap for a small hatchback... put it this way my new GTI ed 30 is a lot quicker than my vr6 and does 35mpg even when ragged.

Also the steering on the VR6 is poor, very heavy turn ins, especially on tracks, there is a rust issue on pre 97 cars, esp on the 4 jack spots under the car...and most 2nd hand cars have been thrashed so most ppl's BHP claims are simply wrong... a 95 car with 100k + miles will not been running at 172 bhp, much more like 150bhp(+ a vr6 will simply not keep up with a new mk 5 gti, ppl claiming 200+bhp ina vr6 can not translate that power to the road in a 0-60), and watch out for stupid mods like replica wheels (very heavy, poor quality that de-value the car ) and de-badging, basically keep it OEM and avoid the tesco car park burnout brigade

however.... its harder to go faster for less cash (clio 172's are much better handling though) BUT.. if u really want the ultimate hot hatch go for a RENAULT CLIO WILLIAMS (pref the ltd edition mk 2 model) as much as I love my vr6 and hate all things French the clio williams is the best, where the vr6 is heavy and boomy, the williams is like a porsche hatchback, and I wish I had never sold mine. they are badly made though, the french make there cars in a barn with hammers...

(highlines weigh more therefore not as fast)!!

[/quote']

Some interesting views! fuel is fuel.....wehn you talk about comparing a 2.0 gti to a near 3 litre one then obviously the fuel is gonna be comparitive higher in it use! thats like saying i love my Ferrari but i hate filling it up with petrol! you wouldnt buy it if you were only concerened on fuel consumption alone......

the vr6 was designed as a fast road car and autobahn cruiser with some decent punch, NOT an out and out track car, if you want to make anything production worthy of use on a track you need to spend the money on the items that make it suitable, like anti roll bars, bushing, clutch, and suspension/tyres and other specialist items designed for the job

the claim about a VR being no match for a Mk5?? what books you been reading? i personally anhialated a Mk5 GTI on an empty motorway a few months back, and he was ringing every last bit out of it, the mid rane torque and power of the VR engine above 70 mph are astounding for a car of its age, I was pulling away from him in every gear after 3rd upto....well lets keep that secret! but it was 3 figures and the middle one was a 4 that was proven by the driver of said gti pulling up beside me at the slip off and showing an approving thumbs up!!!! and mines only got a stainless exhaust Everything else is totally standard even the air filter and its done 91k not bad for a heavy old P reg Highline eh?

Williams clio "Porsche Hatchback"????????????????? NO NO NO ......NO....NO if anything its more like a point and squirt kiddy car.............i have driven Porsches of varying types.....Turbo cabrio.....targa and my best mates 1973 RS 911, i have also had the displeasure of driving a 172 clio and a williams 1......cant say anything too positive about them? other than they are what they are....small... badly built French tripe that goes ok but just dosnt have any......Va Va Voooom... the Volkswagen brand offers so much more than just speed or anything else, its a package and an extremely well engineered car...not a 5 minute wonder with a racing teams name put on it!!!

Dont get me wrong this aint a personal dig at you mate, I just dont agree with some of the observations

haha, no worries mate, I am not comparing my old williams to a porsche, of course not. What the car was though, which is why I mentioned porsche is FOCUSED! the reason porsche have been so successfull from nearly going bust in 1994 to now looking to take over VW group is that all their cars (bar the cayenne and boxster) are focused, and i think the clio williams was the ultiamte focused front wheel drive small car (and the real enthusiats would agree with this, + the integra type r and the corrado vr6 both of which are much better performance cars than the golf vr6 but i would only ever want a corrado if i had to swap!) I too have drive a couple of porshces, the best being my mates 993 turbo S which was on another planet car wise to anything ive driven, even me bruvs M3 CSL... so yes I agree with you there!

and yes ur right, french cars are 99% of the time absolute shite, just like most european cars that arnt made or owned by germans. I do think my and all golf vr6s are awesome, great on the motorway great on the b road, and practical and fairly discreet,,, its very hard to get a better car fro the money! but any old car, expecially ones with high performance engines that cover high mileage will lose some BHP, perhaps Ive underestimated the strength of the vr6 engine beyong 150k miles.... id like to bet though that a 92/93 vr6 in autotrader for £1500 with 150k miles will defo not be running at 172 bhp...i dont think thats a controversial thing to say!

as for debadging.... i love it on £20 grand project cars that win shows, it looks amazing with the smoothed bumpers and neutral colour scheme (a la tony paynes stuff) but on many of the cars i see in south London... old knackered vr6's with ridiuclous 18inch rims with no concern for handling or balance, debadged and with wonky exhausts.. they give the rest of us vr6 owners a bad name and image... it ruins the legacy and reasoning behind the car (and yes i know the vr6 was made as the 1st premium hathcback paving the way for todays bmw 130i, audi s3 and the r32!)

but all the replies to my ramblings i agree with! better get back to pretending to do work now before the boss notices ive been typing rubbish for 20 mins!! :$

[Ben Seabrook 4]

Hello mate,

Yes i would advise you to get one as they are fabulous fun and a hell of a lot of car for your money. BUT do take your time when looking for one as plenty of them have been thrashed to bits. I have had mine for 2 years now and the only problem was the head gasket but it is a mayor problem if you cannot do the work yourself !!! However even after that i would not trade it in for anything and I agree with most people on here that there is not much out there that will pull away from you if you decide to put your foot down !!!