Changing wishbones

[ip 0]

Anyone changed their wishbones recently? What's involved? Any major pitfalls?

I'll do the ball joints and arb links while I'm down there so, as far as I can tell, it's a case of removing the front and rear mounting bolts (renew), getting the top nut off the ball joint where it passes through the hub, and removing the old arb link.

I figure reassembly should be okay since I won't be dealing with seized parts.

I've heard that I have to jack the engine up to get at one of the wishbone bolts. Does anyone know which one this is?

Cheers,

ip

[Phat VR6 3]

you got it prity much stop on fella, Personally id undo the 3 13mm that hold the ball joint in the wishbone and leave the ball joint attached to the hub knuckle, Its alot easier that way, Its the N/S rear one that needs the engine lifting, Al tho it doesn't need to be lifted a lot

[ip 0]

I'm not sure the 13mm bolts are ever coming out (the heads are near rusted away). Either way, I suspect the ball joints are worn out too so I think I would need to separate them from the hub knuckle anyway.

What's the issue with removing the ball joint from the hub knuckle BTW? I figured I'd just need to remove the top bolt and then hopefully it would just need a few taps with the hammer to get it out? Any tips?

Cheers,

ip

[Phat VR6 3]

oh if your changing the ball joints anyway then you got no choose lol.. Thought if you where just changing the wishbone and keeping the old ball joints you would have save your self some time and effort.

Yep just undo that nut and give it a few taps, But tbh it normally needs a few hard whacks lol. Id do this first so you can pull down on the wishbone at the same time, You can normally get a pry bar in somwhere to give you more leavage down. If it still doesnt move then you can buy ball joint splitter than make it nice and easy (the finger thumb screw treaded type)

You shouldn't have any problems tbf mate good luck lol

[ip 0]

Do you mean this type of splitter?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Draper-19Mm-Capacity-Ball-Joint-Separator_W0QQitemZ160286429117QQihZ006QQcategoryZ30917QQcmdZViewItem

Looks like a fairly useful bit of kit to have at your disposal when working on a rusted Scottish car. I tell you, my last car (Polo) came from London before I owned it and the bottom was clean as a whistle. Scottish cars get absolutely pounded by the salt on the roads at winter.

Cheers,

ip

[ip 0]

Man! 10 hours on Sunday with three (competent) guys and only got one wishbone done! Not helped by factors sending me the wrong bloody arb links but even then!

Basically took 4 hours to get the ball joint out. Ball joint could not be removed from the wishbone as all bolts had rusted into place and heads sheared off when turned. Not enough space to get a drill in but even if I had, I reckon it was rusted into the w'bone anyway.

So, tried to get the ball joint nut off but it was just rust and rounded off even with my decent snapon spanners. So, had to get a nut splitter on it. To get nut splitter on, had to saw top of bolt off to get enough space to slide it over nut. Once the nut was off, we spent 2 hours using a variety of ball joint extractors (and cutting w'bone in half with angle grinder to improve access) until finally using the 'blue spanner' to heat it up. Worryingly close to the cv gaiter but had to be done.

After that, had to jack up the engine to get to the front driver's side w'bone bolt out. Engine mount bolts were a dog to get to but still looked easier than removing the sump (another 20 mins). In fairness, the front and reat w'bone bolts were a peice of piss compared to the rest of the job (just need a decent 18mm socket and a breaker bar)

Putting the new w'bone in was a breeze after that lot but had to put the old arb link back on while factor sends me the right parts. Looking forward to doing it all again next Sat on the passenger side. Brutal.

While I was down there I noticed that the guys at Farmer Autocare had ywisted the steernign rack boot around the track rod end and rack when they did the tracking (didn't release the clip on the track rod when they rotated it). As a result, the boot had been dragged through the rack and pinion and was now gone. So, I've been driving round for the last 5 weeks with no boot on the rack. No wonder its feeling lumpy. Got an appt with their senior manager tomorrow to argue the case for them installing anew rack for me (idiots).

All in, a tough job and not even half way through yet. On the upside though, I do now know how to set up my own camber which will save me a load of cash every time I need to mess around with the front of the car. I'll write it up when I have a moment.

Cheers to all who gave advice,

ip

[ip 0]

Tried to do second wishbone today. Got ball joint separated no bother and rear wishbone bolt was a doddle. Then disaster. Tried to take the front bolt off (huge 18mm affair) and somehow twisted the head right off the bolt (wasn't even trying that hard).

So, now I've got a bolt with no head still running through the wishbone bush (so I can't get to the shaft of the bolt either) and seized into an internal nut which is inside the front subframe. As a result, I can't get the wishbone off but the car is not safe to drive.

I have a friend who's a mechanic and he's going to try to cut the wishbone out with an oxy torch but if that fails, then I'm going to need a whole new subframe and basically will have to scrap the car (to big and expensive a job to justify). All for one feckin bolt!

The car has just had a new clutch, brake pads and disks (8000 miles back), new radiator, new HT leads, new rear tyres, new shocks, new H&R springs, new stainless back box and a whole host of other minor new parts. It's a 1995 with 100k on the clock. Anyone want to make me an offer?

Shite day.

ip

[Phat VR6 3]

dude WTF don't scrap it for that..... Get a sub frame from a scrap yard or ebay.

Ive just scraped one that you could have had

Changing that sub frame isn't that hard, I did it in about 5 hours including new rack and polly bushes, No need to remove the engine or anythink like that,

Just support engine drop ball joint from wishbone not hub, Undo PAS pipes on back of rack (right bastard tbf) Undo engine mount bolts and remove, Then from inside the cab at your feet remove plactics, 2 13mm nuts that conect the rack to the stearing collom, Undo these, then undo 4 main subframe bolts and drop subframe off

You can then fit pollys and your new rack, wishbones into new subframe and put it all together again 1 day if nothink goes wrong and your done

Def worth changing subframe over scrapping car

Don't give up yet, I no it getting stressing when things don't go as they should but have a brake and come back to it and its never as bad as you thought in the first place...

[ip 0]

Cheers for the wise counsel Phat VR6. For the time being, I have entrusted the car to my mate's garage and his skilled use of the oxy torch. His theory is that the bolt is seized in the metal sleeve of the wishbone bush and so plans to cut the wishbone out to get access to the bush and then the bolt. Could be a few hours work but stillcheaper than a new subframe and another weekend of my time. Fingers crossed.

Failing that, you're right, I should look into a new subframe. There are a couple going on ebay for about £100 inc postage. Still looks like a dog od a job mind. The ones I'm seeing for sale are VERY clean compared to mine. The salted roads in Scottish winters seem to make a huge difference to the amount of corrosion and seized bolts you can expect to find on a car. It's all the cutting and drilling out of bolts that Make these jobs so difficult.

BTW, if I do change the sub frame but wanted to keep the exisintg steering rack and bushes (they're actually okay) can the steering rack easily be left in place while the subframe is removed? If I could avoid having to deal with that particulare nightmare then the job would seem a lot less daunting.

Cheers,

ip

[ip 0]

My mate just phoned. It took him and his workmate 1.5 days to cut the old bone out and get the new one fitted (they also did the arb links and splash shield on the brakes while they were down there). £240 labour!!!! in fairness that is only £20 per hour and there were two of them working on it so I can't really complain but holy sh*t this car is a money pit!!!

I could have got a new subframe for about £100 and tried fitting it myself but since all the bolts down there are so rusted, who knows how long it would have taken to get the old one out. It does seem like a brutal job without ramps too.

All in, not a pleasant experience but at least it's done. You southerners with your unsalted roads don't know how good you've got it!

The kicker is that I still have to do the camber (I'll do that myself) and pay someone to do the tracking!!!

ip

[Phat VR6 3]

glad you got it sorted dude, £240 isn't bad considering the work you saved yourself

When working on my car i offend think fuck this im taking it to a garage. People think garages are expensive but after trying to do the work your self they seem VERY cheep indeed lol

PS leave your car how it is for a while lol DONT take a spanner to it

[ip 0]

Sage advise Phat. I must stop trying to return the car to showroom condition and just enjoy driving it for a while!

ip

[bear 0]

youv'e put me of doing my wishbones,the rear bushes are worn,not sure what to replace them with,poly or original.all the bolts will come of but not tryed the 3 13mm.thinking of buying new wishbones and getting the bushes pressed in,then all i've got to do is take the old ones of and fit the new ones,sounds easy,bit like when i changed the rear wheel bearings !

[finny 0]

Had major trouble with the front bolt on the passenger side wishbone; couldn't get the bolt off and in the end subframe removed and a socket welded/ applied heat to bolt b4 the bolt shifted.

Also we put in solid rear wishbones bushes from R32/TT so bit more work than buying wishbones with bushes already fitted. My mechanic couldn't understand why I didn't get new wishbones with bushes already fitted!

Also had a bit of trouble getting one of the 3 13mm bolts off, eventually done with an angle grinder wearing away head of the stuck bolt.

Good luck as my bushes needed replacing as it was suppose to be a MOT failure (?) otherwise.