RBPE
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Posts posted by RBPE
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Should be able to hunt one down, few shops were advertising the B41 if that's it, Google's your friend peeps!
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On 05/04/2017 at 0:01 PM, Steve bain said:
also, as i am fitting it into a mk2 scirocco and i can find no information at all (google - you failed me) about fitting a VRT in a mk2 scirocco i am nervous about how close the turbo will be to the raintray with a cast manifold. The same goes with the short intake. The solution is to make a manifold so i can locate the turbo nice and close to the engine and no higher than the original intake so i know it will clear the bonnet. ( i plan to build it out of the car and then fit it over the winter) I was thinking about keeping the 2 short cast manifolds which are on there now and making a 2-1 manifold like the one in the image. I would make it from 1.75" exhaust pipe steel (i can weld steel, but have never tried stainless). where the 2 pipes join and go into the turbo i would make a plenum or sorts with a wastegate outlet so i can run a single wastegate.
A new Wuxi Holset would probably come to £500-550 or so, linked one in the "What turbo" thread is a 12cm too - only a few hundred more for a new Holset, what I would probably go for.
You'd be surprised what you can fit in an old Rocco bay;
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Pretty cool vid showing the combustion process;
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On 4/10/2017 at 7:42 PM, mazhar said:
Hi my car i don't know what's wrong with it while am driving it's changing gears down wards and switching it'self off can I get help it's golf 5 R32
When you say switching itself off do you mean closes the throttle? That usually means running lean and is what the ecu does, can be various reasons though, MAF (HFM), dodgy injectors, fuel pump problem etc, also DSG/Mechatronic prob.
If it's turning the electrics off then it's usually a short/wiring problem, could be wires or perhaps a loose battery shorting?
VCDS/VAG COM is your friend though! Many use copied ones on their own cars due to cost; later ecu's with better OBD programming work better than old ones, RL tends to be better ones, can be windows specific etc, have a look into it dep on your ecu code, should be info on ecu tuning forums;
Also ME7 Logger is free but can be temperamental on some ecu's, esp the 6 cylinder ecu's;
http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php/topic,1079.0title,.html
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Bought a few weeks ago from a friend as it was too good to pass up, has had loads of work done and was sat in the unit for months due to too many cars. I was thinking about a big turbo build on it but it's a good daily for someone and want a 6 cylinder for that - as such, sensible offers or would swap for a V6 4 motion.
51 reg 1M Leon Cupra AUQ 180hp
133k - 3 owners
High end LPG system with switchable button11 months MOT
New brake lines, some sill welding and other bits done for MOT
New discs and pads all round about 1k ago
New k03s turbo CHRA around same time
New flywheel and clutch at the same time
New battery
Elec windows, mirrors, sunroof, Audi darker dash
17" Audi alloy wheels
BMC Induction kit
BAD BITS:
Cosmetic really, there's a bit of paint that seems to be coming off on near side rear (near the arch - will get a close up if need be) - about a few inches in size, looks like white speckle. Also the sill down that side was welded for the MOT (by one of the lads who's a pro welder) and only quickly tidied up as the car needed to leave the unit sharp ish due to space, doesn't bother me to be honest as I don't notice it but will add pic. Steering wheel is worn, one of the glove box arms is broken although it open and closes properly and the rear window wires don't do much save for one or two of them.
Will be sporting a Stage 1 or 2 map at your request (195-230hp), although the stage 2 will need front mount and de cat to get the most - can get de cat and mid pipe done in mild for you for £120 max. I've upped the speed limiter and rev limit, proper dyno developed tunes and can add some bits like pops on over-run etc if need be.
Manchester area and ideally want a V6 4 motion swapped for it if I can, no rush to sell but offers welcome.
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On 02/04/2017 at 11:20 AM, Steve bain said:
Thanks for all the great advice. I have been looking around and I think I want to run a stage 2 c2 chip so I need a turbo (holset hx 35 is a good shout as seem to fetch £200 s/h) and eBay cast manifold. Genuine Bosch 440cc (which are really expensive!) And a 4inch maf. The link I posted before I read you can use just the housing and my genuine Bosch sensor in it. And then get on the hunt for turbosmart or dial wastegate but most likely A/V and a good quality recirculation valve and decompression plate.
I will probably make a short intake to keep costs down too.
I think I have a plan so can start buying.
£200-250 Holset's are usually just 2nd hand, they can be hit or miss with how good they are, some are in need of a rebuild - budget £450-500 for a remanufactured one already done for you on the bay!
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It's not really that to be honest - if you get dodgy injectors you could have fitment problems... fuel leak + hot engine = big expense! Linearisation problems over time means more tuning = more expense, one runs lean etc. You get a cheap wastegate and it put's too much boost through your set up and runs lean due to lack of fuel = big expense. Cheap turbo material spinning at tens of thousands of revs snaps off it's wheel and goes through your engine = big expense - that's the reasons people do it properly from the start really!
If you're operating on a budget, then don't do too much on your engine first of all as I would be thinking it may be destroyed at any time, so nothing more than a spacer really or I'd usually plan for near a grand for a good refresh and strengthening of the engine. Injectors I wouldn't ever really skimp on to be honest, 2nd hand genuine from reputable seller at worst really, one of them leans out! - and wastegate's are for hot gasses so I would be wise there too as it could have a chain effect in destroying parts.
You want to use a proper MAF as well as the cheap ones play up.
So...
I'd personally opt for a Holset HX35 12cm remanufactured for about £450, 38mm Turbosmart wastegate for £250 ish (or 2nd hand ones knock about from time to time) same for a 34mm Kompact recirc is a decent price at £120 ish and bigger than the 25mm ones, together with, (at least) genuine 2nd hand Bosch MAF and injectors (depending on your tuners parts used).
So about a grand for that quality base to build around, then the misc items you mentioned - so £2k budget yet quality kit is easily achievable imo, then the big expense as you up the boost is engine and drive-train!
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Don't skimp on the wastegate, the cheap ones can have problems easily and are often set for high boost, don't get cheap knock off Bosch replica injectors either, same with the recirc valve - if you skimp on the air/fuel parts you're asking for trouble!
Also don't bother with RS4 maf unless the tuner says so, there are different ways depending on what they do, so speak to your tuner before you do any air/fuel metering changes to see what parts they use otherwise you'll just be wasting money there as they'll either tell you to change to what they used for their tunes or further work in mapping and it sounds like you're on a budget.
Have dealt with many ebay turbo users on the 4 cylinder cars and they tend to hold up well at lower boost (year/6000+ miles), I wouldn't put too much stress on cheap metal though, one bit of impeller going through the engine could destroy everything, so I wouldn't spend too much if doing anything ebay special kind of way but your air and fuel is everything in running!
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On 28/03/2017 at 9:45 AM, VR6Pete said:
some good info there @RBPE
Updated it a bit and added some more links
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Oh and usually, from the US, it was price of item + postage x 20% vat and about 6% import duty - from EU there was none and hopefully HM Gov will not tax or cause import hold ups post Brexit seeing as Germany's 19% VAT is pretty much the same as our 20%.
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Links are in the "what turbo" thread, genuine Wuxi from China are still Holset's, cheapest place you can get them really, UK sellers do them but add on a profit obviously, the 2 ebay companies linked get the Holsets the most, remanufactured and just 2nd hand it seems. Turbo Zentrum is about the cheapest for the Super Pro's and do 14cm, so they're your best option outside of a scrap yard to be honest..... I've done my homework! ;-)
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They're usually twin scroll housings but single or twin will spool well, especially a 35 with 12cm housing, good for a quick spool <500hp build.
Proper benefits from a twin scroll is the correct pulsing of the exhaust gas, so that the engines cycle/expelling of exhaust gas, works in harmony with the collectors and in essence, pushes the gas through without restrictions (laminar v turbulent flow/helmholtz resonance).
A twin scroll manifold or set up that hasn't had this calculated will not benefit as much and could lead to some turbulent flow that can be a hindrance at, for example, low flow levels, more of a problem on a daily than a drag racer then!
They are great turbo's though and you'll not really notice any real problems or differences in a lot of builds if you use a normal T3 open single manifold with a twin scroll turbine on the turbo though, vice versa you could get some turbulence problems as the single scroll turbine expels into a twin divided flange and the gas hits the divide.... in which case I may think about filing the divide down a bit to help negate this.
If your absolutely chasing numbers then something to think about, twin scroll HX with open T3 manifold as what many set ups will be, I reckon you'll be fine, it'll still be a torque monster!
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PART 2:
So, once we have an understanding that there is a lot of marketing spiel, a lot of material and QC variances that you should look into to get the best, let's be more specific to VRT tuning!
Common destruction of engines;
I would say, in my experience, that there are two major factors in destroying engines and no matter how many times I tell people, this can also supersede any of the upgraded material specification aspects mentioned previously, it is what ultimately destroys engines the most in my opinion - age!
Engines are set up for certain tolerances, certain specifications like measurements, that can obviously change with time due to general wear and tear from the forces placed upon them! I did this little mod on a the wiki VR6 drawing but it simply shows how pressure is placed angularly on certain reciprocal parts...
But with other factors to consider!
G = Gravity, naturally pushing down on the offset angles of the reihenmotor - our baby's!
– in short, you've over 14lbs per square inch pressing down on you at any time, ambient pressure, you times this by the parts moving x amount of times over the course of an engines life, in this case angles against forces and so on..... you get wear and tear that changes the engine from how it was designed to be! Imagine gripping a tennis racket handle for example and someone twists it, you naturally loosen your grip, if you left is as is, the friction would burn you and eventually wear your hand down, same principles apply, often why you hear about lubrication of oil for example on rods, but even then this action over time leads to wear and tear! This is what destroys engines really, forces and use!
Quick links;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambient_pressure
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tear_resistance
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shear_force
http://kingbearings.com/files/Geometry_and_Dimensional_Tolerances_of_Engine_Bearings.pdf
Therefore, simple rule is – if you're looking to ensure longevity of your engine, do not think it is necessarily good “as is” just because it runs right! I have dealt with many that think that only to find their engine pop when the boost is turned up, usually due to all sorts from blocked oil pick ups to plugs not even being in properly! I will always maintain that the simple refreshing of an engine by an experience builder, will ensure far greater longevity than leaving it as it is and even some "forged engine builds"! If you can't fork out for forged parts, just refresh it all to oem should really help with longevity.
Reason for that again comes down not to the material in this respect on a used engine - as such material can often receive some form of heat treatment in it's usage over it's lifetime, but the tolerance aspects and additional strains it places upon your components if it is not running right and the sheer depth of pressures/shearing forces depending on something like a small measurement difference and angular sheer stress!
Which moves us onto the tune.....
I assume most of you know that “a controlled burn” is what you always aim to achieve in terms of ecu tuning, the burning of fuel – as is required for correct operation. Detonation is an explosion rather than a controlled burn and this explosion, to cut a long story short, means a hell of a lot more stresses!
So the tune is a very, very, important part, personally I have seen many pro tunes with little component protection/knock control but they still work based on what work has actually been done in testing, plus tunes like ASR (anti-slip/traction-control) dumbed down instead of tuned for example, meaning something works but not necessarily as best it should. Point being - most of you don't know what's in a tune, enquire!
So this explosion/knock, can destroy engines no matter how much you upgrade material spec to be honest, but the pressures alone could shear most materials, even hum dinger forged parts with better properties - you're simply protecting as best possible given resources!
So be aware that tunes.... pretty much anything air/fuel/burn related, is no.1 on the list!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deflagration
EDIT - I put this up on the vid section, good example based on fuel v spark/timing/burn etc;
So we understand the basics on building if looking at upgrading and/or rebuilding with stock so let's focus on building an engine for FI and saving money!
In short, the more you do for an engine builder, the more you will save yourself at the end of the day!
Taking it out of the car, stripping it down and bagging up/tagging parts is a good start, it'll save you a lot so I would do that first of all to save you some pennies. There's plenty of info on the forum for that.
So you save some money by stripping a lot yourself, and you're now aware that you need to specify that the engine builder needs to look into checking oem angles/tolerances etc and will need new oem parts at least for basics like gaskets, rings, bearings etc. This is when you budget for your forged upgrades or you aim your budget at further oem refreshing!
First port of call is the compression ratio then, with stock 6 pots running 10-11.5:1 ratio's as standard depending again on age, skimmed etc, then it would take a lot of tuning to get it right with various sensors missing and ability in the ecu, so generally, for safety's sake and on a road car at least - compression ratio is lowered to help protect from detonation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compression_ratio
What ratio you use can vary, personally, I have dealt with many big turbo/big name owners that run very low compression ratio's (sorting out their big name tunes) and they seem happy, up to dealing with a 2.8 24v owner who ran 9:1 at nigh on 700hp on pump fuel! I would therefore recommend keeping that ratio at 9:1 at most but this can come down to the tune as well, as mentioned, detonation and tune can make a difference so factor that in to what you are doing as those stresses count for a lot, you get different quality of injectors, fuel pumps etc. Get info on the tuners builds if you can (i.e. compression ratio, parts used, boost levels etc) - or simply research lot's of parts details and get an understanding of what they can do.
There are three main options nowadays to lower compression; spacer plate, pistons and rods;
Spacer plates can vary in thickness which brings about various compression ratios, adding a gap between the head and block, options being - roughly 7-10:1 compression I think on the market nowadays. Main thing as boost rises using plates would be squish, which is why head and block studs would be a good upgrade, although you're talking nigh on forged piston money now but deal with the basics first!https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squish_(piston_engine)
Forged pistons we've mentioned above, 4032 will expand less than 2618 which what they all seem to be, various options on skirt mods to negate this, various compression ratio's etc
Another option fairly new to the market is low compression rods, I've dealt with some big name tuners testing these out in Europe and they seem to be happy, it negates the need for a spacer plate and add's strength in design and material, as they are a few mm shorter as you can see, still fairly new at this time though;Material can count for a lot in terms of psi resilience or any physical properties of material and manufacturing processes v stresses and strains;
https://www.capitalsteel.net/news/blog/4130-vs-4340-steel-comparison
Low compression rods have the benefit of adding material strength in these areas as well as lowering compression for detonation purposes, negating the need for pistons and/or a spacer plate!
Some basic overviews;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piston_motion_equations
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_materials_properties
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governing_equation
Ebay rods v Big name
There was an interesting thread on another forum about Chinese rods and I think they came to the conclusion that the rod bolts were the weak point. I put a thread up ages ago to see if I could drum up numbers for some custom x beams (not enough interest though) and in dealing with the manufacturers and suppliers I saw test data of 210,000+psi on the bolts if I remember right, surprised to read that then on that forum thread! Again, this can come down to the manufacturers used and variances in that respect - so I am skeptical about their statements somewhat being a reference to any "Chinese rods" if you will. Of course the big names all put up some data and talk about the development in-house and we all know they tend to hold up - as mentioned in the thread though, there are many factors to consider.
When I was dealing with manufacturers I think it came to in-between a 3rd and half the cost of a part manufactured in the UK (buying/filing patent, moulds and initial product) to outsource it abroad unfortunately, which is why many big name companies have done similar with parts, but the quality specified was still top notch (International QC standards/material spec etc) and the part would have been just as good if I had got the numbers. So, cheaper doesn't necessarily mean any less of a product and the blasé statements about such parts or locations should really be looked into more in depth!
So you have a few options, generally;Rod bolts (stressed area/tolerances v usage) - Low compression plate (various ratio's, needn't go crazy but match to tuners requests) is a good base to start with,
Possibly head studs/main studs/bolts - squish and alignments etc plus strength/clamping forces added here
Low compression pistons - as above really
Rod's - low comp or stock, various material/costs, again as above info
But....... give it a good refresh first, budget that then changes mentioned above as a base to help longevity and that's why some relatively stock engines can reach big power without forged parts. Well.....
The head can set you back a lot.... a hell of a lot really! Not always necessary as some show;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pL6Aq0WwZ3I
But it is the crux of power and is still subject to stresses and strains!
The head can take a lot of money to upgrade but, aside from checking oem tolerances and refreshing as mentioned for the bottom end, you could keep this fairly simple if in good shape.
Valve guides are often the bane of VAG vehicles with high mileage, just general parts refreshing things, I can't really emphasise that enough as I have seen people try and take short cuts time and time again and it always ends up costing them more!Valve float can be a problem on older engines, especially if you are upping rpm limit's like many tunes do, so heavy duty valve springs is a good idea to stop this, again check guides though. Think about the basics logically, you know usage can knacker the springs, we all jumped up and down on the beds as kids and know what happens to springs in the long run, so how harsh a life has your engine led, how much are 2nd hand ones etc, what rpm you gonna run... should all be considered!
Whilst you are stripping your engine for the engine builder or your own DIY you can do some little things yourself, it's what I did years ago, just bought some simple dremel tools, files etc and had a go! You can do things like gasket match your manifold gaskets to your ports, you can chamfer oil and water passages, even have a go at porting and polishing. This work can end up costing lot's of money, you are better with things like flow benches obviously, but you can do some clean up and lot's of measurements and if you're going to have a go at DIY building then why not, just do your homework and be uniform in that if you can!
Cams can help get a lot more power/torque when going NA to FI as many will know, again this should come down to the tune and changes in your set up/your goals as they are generally set up for emissions/daily driving - all of this head work should really be specified to your ecu tune/cams/revs/turbo/boost and it can take up huge amounts of budget - usually pro engine builders will have their own parts they use and a lot of this is worked out with them - in terms of DIY - well, World's your oyster if you educate yourself enough!
So, just a brief overview, I wanted to mention the manufacturing and material side and some basics outside of the usual "forged is better" kind of thing.
- Charlie.nursey, vdubhead and Daverse
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Some basic info if it helps?
1. Understanding design and construction;
In my experience, I was surprised to find that the material specification for something like an Audi 1.4 crankshaft was the exact same as a 3.2 when I did some years of research into parts manufacturing, but in hindsight and more management based experience, it stands to reason really! There's often talk on forums about whether something is forged or not meaning it is stronger but this is often something of a fallacy! Uniformity of the construction of a part can change based on the actual process that is undertaken on the part in question - as an example, say you want something that is 3" thick all across, pouring material through a little hole as in casting, could lead to some areas, for example, only being 2.95", this is therefore a flaw in the manufacturing process (usually why you need to buy moulds and designs and make a few in creating a product). There are some elements to consider, but just because something is forged, doesn't necessarily mean it is naturally stronger, it is nothing more than a manufacturing process.
There are, of course, some benefits to certain manufacturing processes, ensuring a greater uniformity of structure in that example, which ultimately could mean greater "strength" as is required for your application. However, I would look into the variances between forging and casting if you are looking into buying upgraded parts and try not to be fooled with marketing spiel.https://www.google.co.uk/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=casting+or+forging&*
So, what does ensure longevity in this respect? Well, material spec counts for a lot to be honest, this is a major factor in aftermarket parts and I'll let Mahle give a little info on the differences between common aftermarket piston choices;
Generally, in this respect at least, there are certain piston material specifications to choose from, 2618 or 4032 for the most part for piston alloys as well as manufacturing techniques. This is what most of you will look at for your options in aftermarket pistons. However, in my own experience of custom product development, there are (in the UK development I was looking into at least), other options available, notably custom material. I remember reading the material spec sheets for a certain alloy (for pistons) that would outperform both the 2618 and 4032. What was interesting to note though in their tests, was that at typical engine cycle outputs (notably the stresses, strains and heat cycles pistons are subjected to at constant high rpm), the 4032 were better at sustaining the thermal loads (being good at handling the constant heat of an engine in operation) than the 2618 material. In every respect the 2618 was better apart from this sustained load/heat at certain loads, which, to be honest, is what you want for performance engines, but there were factors that you may take into account for parts upgrades like the fact 2618 alloy expands more - hence the rattles more than 4032 pistons in general..... again something you want for a daily rather than a drag machine. Of course, some have negated this problem by using custom material on the skirts/sides of pistons to stop rattling, this, balancing the expansion properties of that particular material and the rattling that people do not want on their daily driver, are all factors to consider!
So - PART 1 - If you're thinking of paying a lot for aftermarket products, I would personally look into these aspects to get the most for what you want, if someone tells you "it's forged, it'll be better!", then it can get far more technical than that! The more someone wants to sell this kind of product, the more I would expect to be enlightened to some details in this respect, there are, of course, sales pitches and some info that they don't want to share (I'd look into things like the spec sheets under stresses and strains or, for cranks for example, looking into things like case hardening processes and what x company does in that respect - best bet to get the info you should want, pester them!).
I would be careful not to be caught up in simple miss-statements like "it's forged, it'll be tougher!" or even, to be honest, "Chinese made stuff is rubbish!" - I have personally done a lot of research into it and it is far more complex than that, material, QC's in manufacturing, cost v every aspect in manufacturing etc is all subjectively relative - lot's can vary here for a start, do your homework though and you'll be fine! - Good example was on the "what turbo" thread where I state about Holset and their Wuxi factory - good QC's no doubt and their material spec is likely to be the same.Coming back to findings then on oem use of material; if VW test out an R32 crank under the extremities they usually do in their usual testing, then lesser engines like a 1.4/1.6 produce less stresses and strains in testing comparatively as an example (not actually true with design limitations and piston speeds etc but for a base example let's say more stress on the best engine means inferior engines will put up with it), then this means they can use the same material across the board that will handle the stresses for a 100k warranty!
Producing a certain mould for a certain part and using the same material, obviously with different moulds for the crank sizes unless, for example 12V/24V cranks, saves a fortune in product manufacturing overall – thus saving millions potentially in production for a company of VAG size and in terms of 12/24v changing the efficiency of heads only... an efficient design change – means that potentially, oem is not always the best compared to aftermarket stuff, even if people tell you it is!
So, for example, this 4130 steel used (I think that is what is used for cranks back then but can't remember, example either way) - will handle all the stresses and strains placed on it when they test their vehicles. So, there is no need for something like a 4340 then as it will only be adding more cost! Not only that, but imagine the discounts in specifying the same steel across the board... 100 tons for all cranks instead of just 5 tons for R32 cranks for example, huge manufacturing savings to be made there! Also, there are other aspects in manufacturing the product to think about in terms of money management as well - machining a part for example. The tougher, or harder in this case, something is, the more difficult it is to machine - 4 hours machining a 4340 crank, or 30 mins on a 4130 adds up to a lot of money in big production models over millions of units! Take a look at case hardening/nitriding/shot peening etc, all aftermarket processes for ultimate performance (but) with added costs as there is more labour involved - doesn't mean something isn't still forged, just what has been done to help.
Ultimately then, there are always budgetary constraints to consider at a management level in the major oem production, I'm all for VW using 4340 specially hardened awesome material for their top of the range vehicles, but ultimately, apart from either finite speciality circumstances, chances are the material will have had some compromises made in production as it saves millions for these reasons!
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On 2/19/2017 at 12:36 AM, vdubhead said:
Found a holset hx40 17cm is that to big or is that the right size before I buy don't want to spend twice
Sorry, not been on. Err, 17cm 40 will be like a GT40R 1AR ish so 4krpm's+ for decent boost, good if you want 600+hp though!
12cm HX35 most likely good for 500 ish hp or so, maybe a bit more, so a 14cm HX35/40 would be one for 500-600hp (all as a base/rule of thumb of course).
So take that with the links above and budget as well as goals, when I say 500hp on a 12cm 35 for example, this is just a rough guide, a very efficient set up can yield 100hp more at the same boost.
As a guide, I'd roughly estimate;
12cm - >15-18psi
14cm - 18-26psi
16/17cm - 25psi+
However, some may want more lag for drivetrain reasons, or use a big un until they have more scope later on?
Idea of spool in the link below too don't forget;
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I have had this reply from the shop about the Wuxi one....
hi,in this HX35 3539697,There is a NO.12 in exhaust housing intake mouth,and in HX40W have 16 or 17 inside,which one do you need?tks.
So - I am taking that to mean 12cm on the HX35 turbine side and 16/17 on the HX40's they sell. Am asking if they do multi-item discounts if any others are interested?
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Oh and p.s.
If you do go the scrap yard route, there are always alternatives!
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You mean the Wuxi ones? New Huddersfield made one's can be very hard to get a hold of and can often be a similar price to a Garrett! Some alternatives though.
From what I can gather there's probably 2 shops on aliexpress selling Wuxi one's, this is one;
I haven't had a reply yet on the turbine side sizes on them though so ?????? - I have seen some UK sellers on ebay selling them with good size turbines though, best to keep an eye out on ebay for them. Just look at the stickers on who's selling what for how much.
The US has a good selection, they like their trucks over there, but factor in any taxes (was 20% VAT and about 5-6% of item+ postage when I checked years ago). There are a few "modified for aftermarket use" ones which I think Zentrum is re-selling below in the link.
Apart from that and sourcing one through a scrappers, a remanufactured one would probably be your best option, these 2 have been running a while sourcing different ones;
None in at mo, but UK based;
And nowadays, just to throw a spanner in the works, B-W journal bearings are cropping up too! (I'll have to do another graph for those flow rates though
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I'll post up if/when I get the Wuxi aliexpress details on the turbine side but any of the others offer a great alternative to the more expensive EFR/GTX unit's.
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Also, on a further note; turbine/boost aspects to think about on Holset's;
If you get a Holset from a scrap yard, off a truck for example, they can have huge turbine sides (>29cm+) - and getting info on the turbine sides from general adverts like on ebay can be difficult, can be big ones like this, if they are shops re-selling them for the truck markets especially! For decent spool you want to be looking at the 11-14cm turbines, 16's or so for the higher outputs (550-600hp+), which some people do for aftermarket sales, but as most are stock diesel engined turbo's, they can therefore be way bigger!
Also, due to the diesel truck market aspects, the wastegate can be set for high boost so when people get them from the scrappers and put them on they get problems as they are boosting 2 bar! Some shops have started selling lower pressure wastegates now and some weld the internal gate shut too due to this, opting to go the external wastegate route. This can also be done for any boost leaks on twin scroll turbines if the wastegate slaves off one runner only for example as some do.
So.....if you are hunting at the scrappers (junk yard for our US owners) or are looking at re-sellers that cater for the truck markets, take care on the turbine sides and also boost pressures set!
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12 hours ago, vdubhead said:
What would be total approx figure one can achieve from the hx35 on a vr6?
Most I've dealt with tend to be looking around 450-500hp max on those 12cm HX35's (all crank hp figures for non UK residents reading this by the way).
On the chart total flow should see you past 600hp (lbs/min x 10) - however in reality there are a number of factors, efficiency of your set up, what turbine size etc so I would say the 12cm is probably good for 500ish hp tops and either larger turbine or start looking into the HX40 past that..
There's an old thread here with spool info on the VR6 plus some on the older T series turbo's.
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Holset info;
*** I think the smaller AR's are out and seem to vary quite a bit but are usually on the sellers post.
From what I can gather, the Holset's from their Huddersfield factory have the blue stickers shown here (left) and the other stickers are the one's made in their Wuxi factory in China. I think anything else is a copy but don't quote me on that.
EDIT:
Also, to clear something up that bugs me - the Wuxi Holset's will likely be just as good as their UK counterparts as they probably stick to the same QC's as their main factory. All this "if it's Chinese it's rubbish!" nonsense people regurgitate is hear say nonsense, same as any other country but depends on conformity to standards, quality can vary hugely between manufacturers if there is no conformity - it's the main thing I learned when looking into part manufacturing and suppliers from over there.
These are produced for the massive truck market over there, so you can bet Holset don't want to lose tens of thousands of unit's production on poor QC and these will follow their International QC standards at a guess - so only problem is the high boost and turbine side aspects as per below.
EDIT: Holsets statements on copies; (might need to ignore stickers then and look at clips and nuts etc according to this)
http://www.myholsetturbo.com/images/holsetcounterfeitprevention.pdf
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When you talk about engine longevity you are talking about forces exerted on the engine; stress, twisting/shearing forces etc so first port of call is what causes it.
I'm amazed by people that spend little time on the fuelling side of things, opting to "upgrade when I reach the limit's" or even rely on the ecu to make changes if needed. Detonation can cause pressures tens or even hundreds of times that of a controlled burn which inexorably lead to component failure, same with excessive heat if a tune's too aggressive and has little or no component protection in place (seen plenty of those).
So my first port of call is usually the fuelling - upgraded injectors and fuel pump then and make sure it's all nice and tight, no leaks anywhere, make sure regulators/lines and so on are up to the job too of course.
The other thing with engine longevity is the condition, I would always recommend either stripping and rebuilding the engine, even if it's just stock parts with a spacer, as the general wear and tear over an engine's life can mean extra stresses and strains on critical stress points like rods and crank. There's also the VR6 design and off-centre stresses as well as natural forces like gravity;
This is why I tend to mention the rod bolt's a lot, there's lot's of forces going on there so best to get it all tight and refreshed really.
The stock clutches tend to hold somewhere around 300-350lb/ft, different material will add greater durability. A Sachs SRE clutch are generally rated to around 450lb/ft - stages of other clutches I would surmise are in-between the 2, probably 10-20% more than stock. Above 450 you're looking at either a 4/6 paddle clutch which some can find grabby for daily driving, these tend to be rated around 500-550lb/ft or a multi plate expensive one which will give better driving characteristics but at a cost.
You needn't break the bank building a reliable VRT, most might just throw in a spacer and some ARP or go straight to forged this and that, you can negate any reliability issues somewhat taking care of the basics though!
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MK1 Golf v Evo/Corrado etc
in The Video Room
Posted
Little beasty, I'm sure we can let him off for a lack of cylinders.... always nice to see a lithe mk1 spanking the usual car mag cover stars let's be honest!